What's Happening in Egypt Right now

MizzNaaa

New member
This is a post I put on my tumblr blog because people have been complaining and asking about the little news that was there. I decided to share it here to try and shed some light about what happened and how things got to this point.


"You can choose whatever name you like for the two types of government. I personally call the type of government which can be removed without violence "democracy", and the other "tyranny"." - Sir Karl Raimund Popper (28 July 1902 – 17 September 1994) As quoted in Freedom: A New Analysis (1954) by Maurice William Cranston, p. 112


``

So, I decided to put this post together for two reasons. First, there's very little going on about what's going on in Egypt -my beloved country- right now on Tumblr. Second, the little that reaches you guys is tainted by Muslim Brotherhood reports, and the general image that the Western Media is putting forward is misleading. Third, I'm Egyptian, I've been very involved (as part of the opposition) and I like to believe that I have credibility enough for you to just stop, and read this.

In a nutshell, Egyptians took too the streets from Wednesday 26th of June on. They demanded that the Muslim Brotherhood's elected president, Mohamed Morsi, step down and have an early presidential election.

The reason behind this is that , simply put, everything we asked for during the first round of revolution back in 25th of January (Bread, freedom, social justice) was not achieved. They were not even close. Prices tripled (literally), only members and supporters of the Muslim Brotherhood were allowed positions of power, they were already taking steps to try to control and censor all kinds of opposition media, journalism, as well as art, human rights movements, NGOs...etc.

Bottom line, they have done exactly what Mubarak had been doing and the opposite of what most of the people (those of us who did not support the radical bullshit of the Muslim Brotherhood and other radical Muslim movements)

Conflict had been on the rise between the people and the government since last November, back when protesters took to the streets after Morsi's blatant power grab.

His grab for power was a response to the Supreme Constitutional Court almost dissembling the controversial Constitutional Assembly after nearly half of it’s members quit.

Their decision to quit was a result of the MB assembly members barring any objections to the constitution they were forcing through.

So to stop the assembly from getting dissembled yet again due to the MB non-cooperative actions, he gave himself said sweeping powers. He literally forced what's left of the assembly, coupled with 'extra' members -who also belonged to the MB and other radical muslim movements- to finish the constitution overnight.

Fast forward a few months later. On April 28th 2013, a movement called Tamarod (Rebel) was founded.

Their goal was to gather 15 million signatures for a petition against Morsi aiming to oust him and have a new presidential election before the 30th of June 2013, which was the day Morsi completed the first year of his presidency.

The movement gained momentum at an astonishing speed, gathering over 22,000,000 signatures instead of the original 15,000,000 goal. That, however, was completely disregarded by the Muslim Brotherhood, the government, and their supporters.

They went as far as try to deny any 'allegations' of Tamarod gathering so many signatures, defaming them, accusing them of being funded by western governments...etc.

A week before June 30th, after realizing that the government was simply not paying heed and that people seem to be taking this very seriously, the Army stepped up. They informed the government that they had one week to unite all political factions, supporters and opposition, in order to reach common grounds, as they believed Egypt was heading in a very dangerous direction; or else, they would step in and ensure that people's demands are met.

Again, this was met with complete disregard by the government, who ignored the armed forces and the calls for mass demonstrations on June 30th. On Wednesday the 26th, Morsi gave a 2.5 hour speech -if one could even call it that - where he gossiped, made fun of circulating rumors (some of them were very much founded in reality) and accused people of corruption, mentioning them by name, in one of the most embarrassing rants I've ever witnessed.

Then 30th of June came and this happened.



33 million people took to the streets all over Egypt to protest against Morsi and Muslim Brotherhood's rule. The Sheer scale of this protest was ignored and in response the Muslim Brotherhood gathered their supporters and had a demonstration that was packed with somewhere around 300,000 to 500,000 people in a square called "Rab'a Al Adaweya" that is near "Al Etehadeya" Palace.

The Tamarod movement founders gave the president an ultimatum, if he didn't step down in 48-hours, by 5 pm on 2nd of July 2013, he'd face mass civil disobedience.

You guessed right, Tamarod's ultimatum was ignored by the government. The next day General El- Sisi, came out on t.v. and gave the famous 48 hours Ultimatum.

Morsi responded by defying the Army. His speech had a very clear underlying message basically saying that regardless of what the people and the army want, stepping down would only happen, "Over my dead body". He suggested that his absence from power would cause violence. It was very reminiscent of a similar speech by Mubarak in which he said it would either be him or chaos.

So today, people went to the protests like they have been doing for the past week and waited to see the Army's response to Morsi's defiance, which ended as expected. The Army removed Morsi, handed the government over to the Supreme Constitutional Court and named the head of the court the acting president. They assigned him and leaders of several factions to form a technocratic temporary government that would lead Egypt through the transitional period, additionally suspending the Muslim Brotherhood-made constitution.

Now, I have to take a moment and say this: Morsi reported what happened, which was then reported by Western Media, as a military coup. That is not entirely accurate. The Military merely acted on the will of the people and did not seize power. They handed the government over to those whom the people wanted in power and went back to securing the country.

If by coup, you mean that, then fine, call it whatever you want. But this was not unconstitutional, this isn't against people's will, this isn't the army seizing power. This is what the majority of our people wanted. (Those who did not support the Muslim Brotherhood anyway)

PS- This post is relatively short considering the subject matter. I've skipped over many details, and I'm sure whoever would read this would still have many questions. You can research, you can ask me and I'll try to answer to the best of my ability, but if you want to know more, you'll need to research beyond what CNN/BBC/whatever Western Media outlets are reporting.

Fully understanding why Egyptians needed to end the Brotherhood's theocratic rule would require a series of posts. I might consider this once I'm done researching their entire history.

Hope that helped
 

PracticalDancer

New member
Thank you for sharing that. It has been very hard to follow in the media I typically use.

I would like to ask one thing, if I may . . . and I ask strictly out of scientific curiosity and NOT to cause debate or political discourse: Have you found the source that put forth the 33,000,000 number? What is under question are the sources for the number and the repeated statement "the largest peaceful protest" in human history. I do not dispute that there are a LOT of people in the streets of Egypt. The thing is, many bloggers here cite the BBC as the sources for both; but, searches of the BBC site do not confirm it.

This may be another good thing to research as you are able.
 

Mosaic

Super Moderator
Thank you MizzNaaa, excellent write up oif events. I think it is great that the military handed rule to the supreme constitutional court, an excellent way to go until new elections are held. I sure hope that the "right" president & government gets in this time. A government whose agenda is for the people & Egypt's wellbeing & future. Hurrah! for the force of the Egyptian people. You are very strong People.
~Mosaic
 

MizzNaaa

New member
@Practical Dancer, that's a very valid point. It does seem more like a rumor than anything else, however I was merely using what was being said.

Whether the number is accurate or not, no one truly knows, let's just keep it at a crap ton of people protested? :p
 

AndreaSTL

New member
Are those pictures of the protest or usual Thursday evening traffic? :lol:

I'm seeing this post after I responded to the other one, but in a nutshell I'm so glad that Morsi is out! I was concerned when he was elected, but I thought he was smarter than this. I figured he would try to keep the overt MB influence to a minimum. I assumed he would rule leaning in that direction and place like-minded individuals in positions of power. I was afraid it would start out small and inconspicuous until all of a sudden there they are, entrenched and leaving you wondering how it happened and trying to figure out how to fix it. I'm actually relieved that it happened so quickly and out in the open, but I'm sorry that people had to lose their lives to do so.
 

Tarik Sultan

New member
My 2 cents. Things had to go down the way they did. If the MB was not given the chance to rule, then people would have said that they were never given the chance, the only solution to our problems are XYZ, yatta, yatta, yatta. By having their turn at bat they proved to the majority of the people that they did NOT have the answers. I think this episode has put to rest the fears of the Egyptian people allowing the country to turn into a Taliban type theocracy. I am nervous, but i think what will come out of this is a government that protects everyone's rights because the people have demonstrated that they are not willing to turn back to the way things were, nor are they willing to let themselves be hijacked.

I don't know what struggles the future holds, but I am confident that the Egyptian people are competant enough to work it out. It hasn't been bloodless, but just consider what the USA, France, Spain and many other European countries went to on the road to democracy and Egypt is by comparison miraculously calm thus far.
 

Zorba

"The Veiled Male"
Excellent - let's all hope it continues to evolve in a beneficial direction.

Theocrats the world over - including the US variety - need to take notice.
 

Sophia Maria

New member
MizzNaaa thank you for the post. It was interesting to consider that as well, and reminds me I need to get out of my American shell and really get up to speed with things. I followed the news well this spring, but fell completely out of the loop as things got busier in the past month. I really want to try and understand though.
 

khanjar

New member
My 2 cents. Things had to go down the way they did. If the MB was not given the chance to rule, then people would have said that they were never given the chance, the only solution to our problems are XYZ, yatta, yatta, yatta. By having their turn at bat they proved to the majority of the people that they did NOT have the answers. I think this episode has put to rest the fears of the Egyptian people allowing the country to turn into a Taliban type theocracy. I am nervous, but i think what will come out of this is a government that protects everyone's rights because the people have demonstrated that they are not willing to turn back to the way things were, nor are they willing to let themselves be hijacked.

I don't know what struggles the future holds, but I am confident that the Egyptian people are competant enough to work it out. It hasn't been bloodless, but just consider what the USA, France, Spain and many other European countries went to on the road to democracy and Egypt is by comparison miraculously calm thus far.

Yes, democracy, but democracy worries me because most democracies are representational and representatives can be bought and there betray those they represent until they are ousted at the next elections which could be years away.

But one thing about what I have seen these past few years is that the Egyptians have balls they will not put up with what does not serve them as can anyone imagine western countries fielding so many people in protest at their rulers ? What the Egyptian people create will be worth the trouble for my guess is the Egyptian people will not rest until they get what actually works for them and good luck to them !

And yes I do believe the people of this world would be best served if religion took a back step as there is nothing wrong with belief, spirituality is good, but where it goes wrong is when it enters into politics and controls the lives of non believers.
 

khanjar

New member
Hope that helped

It did and parts of it have been used to refute popular belief within my circle of acquaintances who read newspapers for indeed western media is as ever not entirely honest in it's reporting, where I did say to those they would be best served if they desire more of the truth of anything to seek beyond home media for it is very true we are only told what is politically expedient for us to know.
 

Amulya

Moderator
My friend just left Egypt yesterday and he talked with a lot of people there in the last few days. He said that a lot of people have the idea that the president has been put up by America and that the Muslim Brotherhood is supported by America (so he tried real hard to make sure people didn't think he was American, he's Australian, but it's easy to confuse someone just by their looks)
He's safely in Jordan now as he had to flee the country (somehow he was staying at a place too close to the square, not sure why he was there, but maybe at the time he got there it was deemed safe)
 

khanjar

New member
My friend just left Egypt yesterday and he talked with a lot of people there in the last few days. He said that a lot of people have the idea that the president has been put up by America and that the Muslim Brotherhood is supported by America (so he tried real hard to make sure people didn't think he was American, he's Australian, but it's easy to confuse someone just by their looks)
He's safely in Jordan now as he had to flee the country (somehow he was staying at a place too close to the square, not sure why he was there, but maybe at the time he got there it was deemed safe)

Yes, that is why I said what I said regards other nations keeping their political noses out as it is known Britain also supported the MB which does not bode well for Britons either for someone will always take their angst out on people who have no say but just happen to be of the offending nationality and there relations could be broken by attacking the blameless when Egypt needs friends not enemies.

But with the anti muslim sentiment brewing in Britain there were many questions as to why Britain's leaders supported the MB, where what we were fed was that the MB were moderates and better moderates than what could seize power in the region.
 

MizzNaaa

New member
If you've read my post, Amulya, you'll know they're the farthest thing from moderation.

Here's footage from the demonstrations on 30th of June.
[video=youtube_share;nwix_CMMLWA]http://youtu.be/nwix_CMMLWA[/video]

Also, here's an example to the kind of reaction the MB and its supporters pulled after what happened.

And sadly; yes, the United States and the UK both have been supporting the MB. Not because they're moderate but because of interests in the area. Either way, we'll see how it goes from here.
 

Yame

New member
My friend just left Egypt yesterday and he talked with a lot of people there in the last few days. He said that a lot of people have the idea that the president has been put up by America and that the Muslim Brotherhood is supported by America (so he tried real hard to make sure people didn't think he was American, he's Australian, but it's easy to confuse someone just by their looks)
This is absolutely ridiculous. At some point the Egyptian people need to accept blame for their own actions. Yes, the American government put its support behind the Muslim Brotherhood but that was AFTER Morsi won free and democratic ELECTIONS in Egypt. Morsi won the elections and that is something Egyptians should not be blaming the US for, they should be asking themselves why they voted for him in the first place and how not to make this same mistake again.

Nobody here in the US was happy at all about the MB having won, it was not at all the ideal situation for American interests but they grudgingly accepted the reality. It would have been WRONG for the US to continue supporting Mubarak as most of the Egyptian people were asking for him to step down (as it was wrong for the US to prop his military dictatorship up for so long, as well as other dictatorships all over the Middle East, South America, etc which the US has propped up, this was actually a POSITIVE CHANGE in American foreign policy) and it would have been WRONG for the US not to support the leader the Egyptians themselves chose.

I just wish Morsi never won to begin with. He proved himself an even worse leader than Mubarak. That was actually the fear that many people in the US and in the international community had all along with the Arab Spring. I remember very clearly speaking with many Egyptians and watching interviews all over international news channels with the Egyptian opposition back in 2011. People were much more concerned with taking down Mubarak than they were about what would happen next. Nobody in Egypt seemed to care about the possibility that the Muslim Brotherhood would come to power. It was mostly the US who was scared about that possibility.

I'm really happy for Egypt that they were able to take down another tyrant so quickly before it was too late. Who knows where Morsi would have taken Egypt if he was allowed to finish his term. Ideally even with a bad first president, Egypt would have been able to let him finish his term because it's impossible to accomplish any stability in a new democracy, right after a revolution, within just a year. However if on top of that, they are trying to establish Islamic rule, trying to grab more power than even the previous dictator had, that is something that can not be allowed to go on and it warrants an overthrow.

But I hope the Egyptians will be careful. This is not over yet. Don't allow the military to put in place the same people who were responsible for Mubarak's rule. Don't allow the military to intimidate and jail dissenters as it used to do during his rule. Make sure that you are heading towards democracy this time, and not just another military dictatorship which was the reason you guys overthrew Mubarak to begin with!
 
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~Diana~

AFK Moderator
I just finished reading 6 different articles and in half of them had quotes from egyptians saying americans were supporting the old goverment and the other half are saying that americans are behind why the old goverment was thrown out.. Oi! Really they need to get it together you can't have one goverment body supporting and yet at the same time throwning out another goverment body. It's a damied if you do and damed if you don't situation.

Sadly there are very few people who make good leaders. Many get 'power hungry' as we call it when they get to be a leader. They all start off as normal and would seem to make a good leader but then the power goes straight to their heads and you end up in a nightmare.

Yame I agree for them to be careful but nobody knows how other will react. For example your own USA past presidents. So many hated bush junior for years yet they kept re-electing him!? Right now many are vocal about their dislike of Obama yet the same peopel re-elected him? Now that I don't understand.
 

MizzNaaa

New member
This is absolutely ridiculous. At some point the Egyptian people need to accept blame for their own actions. Yes, the American government put its support behind the Muslim Brotherhood but that was AFTER Morsi won free and democratic ELECTIONS in Egypt. Morsi won the elections and that is something Egyptians should not be blaming the US for, they should be asking themselves why they voted for him in the first place and how not to make this same mistake again.

Uhm, no one is blaming the US for the MB winning. We are blaming the US for being so utterly unashamed about supporting dictatorships here, so long as these dictatorships work to defend US interests in the area, which both Mubarak and the MB did.

We KNOW why the Muslim Brotherhood won; whether these reasons ever made it to your media is another thing. But we know the reasons why they won and I could explain them here but that would take a looong series of posts.


Nobody here in the US was happy at all about the MB having won, it was not at all the ideal situation for American interests but they grudgingly accepted the reality. It would have been WRONG for the US to continue supporting Mubarak as most of the Egyptian people were asking for him to step down (as it was wrong for the US to prop his military dictatorship up for so long, as well as other dictatorships all over the Middle East, South America, etc which the US has propped up, this was actually a POSITIVE CHANGE in American foreign policy) and it would have been WRONG for the US not to support the leader the Egyptians themselves chose.

Are we talking about the people or the government? Because when we speak about the US we speak of the government not the citizens. Your government was not at all opposed to the Muslim Brotherhood winning or 'unhappy' about it, because the MB vowed to keep US interests untouched in the area.

People were much more concerned with taking down Mubarak than they were about what would happen next. Nobody in Egypt seemed to care about the possibility that the Muslim Brotherhood would come to power. It was mostly the US who was scared about that possibility.

That is a VERY misinformed statement. The one thing people were worried about from day one was THAT. In particular. It wasn't just the US worried about the MB coming to power...frankly, I think the US was more concerned about how to make sure that whoever comes to power is an ally than WHO comes to power. So no, you saying that we were so busy revolting that we didn't look at the future is simply inaccurate.

People aren't annoyed at the US and the UK because we think the US is the reason Morsi won. We are annoyed because the US, the UK and the western media is trying to portray what the majority of the people wanted as a Military power grab/coup and an evil death of democracy and legitimacy blah blah blah, when what we did is what Democracy is ALL ABOUT.

PS- people making uninformed comments like the one Diana mentioned are usually people who -I am sad to say this- have a tendency to be ignorant and just hear bits and pieces off of news and other people talking and repeat what they thought they heard. The US isn't behind the MB winning or losing, the US is merely looking out for their own interests like any other government.
 
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Daimona

Moderator
People aren't annoyed at the US and the UK because we think the US is the reason Morsi won. We are annoyed because the US, the UK and the western media is trying to portray what the majority of the people wanted as a Military power grab/coup and an evil death of democracy and legitimacy blah blah blah, when what we did is what Democracy is ALL ABOUT.

It was truly fascinating to read your post some days ago, then observing how our media portrayed the current events. The last couple of days, the focus is slowly changing as they've interviewed Egyptian citizens in Norway sharing your point of view.

I hope for all the best, whatever that may be, for you and Egypt in the years to come. :)
 

Zorba

"The Veiled Male"
So many hated bush junior for years yet they kept re-electing him!? Right now many are vocal about their dislike of Obama yet the same peopel re-elected him? Now that I don't understand.
Not to derail the original intent of this thread - but AS I SEE IT - the problem with the US is extremes. I had little use for both Bushes, disliked Clinton, and detest Obama. We only have a choice between Socialism and a strange form of Theocratic Nazism. Most people are stuck in the middle and want neither! But as long as people support one of the other of the two major parties, this is what we'll keep doing: vacillating between the two. Pick your form of slavery, America.
 

Aniseteph

New member
FWIW the gist I am getting from the BBC's main news coverage is not straight-up military coup. There was coverage of the big protests and there's usually a positive pro-people-power vibe to those (or maybe that's just my personal take on it... I dunno). Lately they have been showing MB supporters protesting about overturning a democratically elected leader, but there's been enough coverage already to give us a clue that it's more complicated than power hungry generals jumping in when they see a chance.

Now they are covering shootings. Keep yourself safe MizzNaaa.
 
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