Appearance is Important

Greek Bonfire

Well-known member
Just for the Night Owl record: it is 4:57 a.m., I just finished a good eight hour shift of writing proposals, and I am going to bed. Let the Morning Larks try that schedule and survive.;)

Sophia Loren made them all look like school girls.

Ouch - I would love to have a schedule like this!

Sophia - oh she still is a hot babe! And she's a full bodied girl too! :dance:
 

Belly Love

New member
I don't care what my friend wants to wear; I care about her feelings getting hurt by people being nasty. If she knows it is age-inappropriate or unflattering and is likely to get comments and doesn't give a rats behind, fine - up to her.

And I agree.

Re: the TPBDC thread: critisizing or praising costume construction and design is a far cry from telling our friends and family members that they look like hell in an outfit that obviously pleases them. Age appropriate behavior and dress is something parents and public schools foist on children until they are old enough to escape us. Once a person reaches adulthood, the foisting becomes condescending at best and rude at worst.

In one of her many brilliant bursts of insight, dear Miss Manners wrote, "You may call this hypocrisy. As a matter of fact, Miss Manners calls it hypocrisy, too. The difference is you probably don't consider hypocrisy one of the social graces and she does."


Hmmm... yeah, I definitely think making fun of people's homemade outfits is way worse then letting a friend know that another dress in her closet compliments her figure better.

*I would never tell a friend she looks like hell. Never. And I typically only give my opinion when asked.

No not me, I said that you could suggest leggings. I would be completely fine with it.

Another option for you could be to say, hey your buttcheeks are showing, and then it is totally up to the person in question to choose if she wants to show her buttcheeks or not.

That is exactly what I would say... and then I most likely would suggest leggings. :)

But really, how often do you see buttcheeks out and about?

I don't see it often, but I see it a couple times a year. I usually think two things, "That woman is desperate for attention" and "Why didn't her friends say something?!" I'm not saying I'm right for my thoughts, but this is how I feel.

You will find far more complaints in this society about a dancer not dressing appropriately for the gig or not taking the time to fix up their hair and makeup then you will about their size or shape. The later simply does not reflect their professionalism and when it comes to presenting this art to the public that is what is really important.

I agree.

LadyLoba- You are spot on about everything! Thanks for actually thinking about what I'm saying instead of going into attack mode out of some insecurity or misplaced anger.

I wouldn't wear half of what my friends wear, but I would never just say to someone, "Wow, that shirt is ugly!" just because I don't like it. If my friend asked me what I thought, and if I thought it was something SUPER unflattering or whatever, then yes, I would tell them I don't think it looks good." And depending on who I'm talking to, totally depends on how I'm going to say it. Some people can handle straight forward critiques and some people can't.

I am quite sure that some of the things I like to wear and feel fabulous in, someone else thinks look silly. I would prefer that other people mind their own business and let me wear whatever I like. And LadyLoba, really, a bag? I don't see the catastrophy in that. I am sure you looked perfectly fine.

I can understand what you're saying- I, myself, have had many unwarranted criticisms over the years over something I've worn (due to something fashion forward that the gp didn't quite "get" or had not gotten yet, until it became mainstream that is). But I think this is an over generalization of the subject. Having an opinion and sharing that opinion to a specific individual makes a lot of difference too.

On a personal level, I usually only share an opinion when asked.
 
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Jane

New member
I see a big difference between criticizing:

a person and a costume

things a person can change and things they can't

an easy fix and a life style change

a friend and a stranger

a comment made tactfully in private and one bluntly made in public

offering a solution and walking away

a constructive comment to help and a destructive one to hurt
 

Shanazel

Moderator
Hmmm... yeah, I definitely think making fun of people's homemade outfits is way worse then letting a friend know that another dress in her closet compliments her figure better.

Well, honey, count me among the way worse then, because I love discussing truly bad costumes almost as much as I love discussing truly good ones. I've made my share of both and the bad ones generally make the best stories.

Most of the TPBDC costumes are for sale or on the bodies of professional dancers. That's part of the criteria for posting. Occasionally Sally Sue Beefsmiff's homemade practice costume appears, but someone always raises a hand to point out it's not apropos to include such things. If she's trying to sell it on E-Bay, though, it becomes fair game.
 
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Belly Love

New member
I see a big difference between criticizing:

a person and a costume

things a person can change and things they can't

an easy fix and a life style change

a friend and a stranger

a comment made tactfully in private and one bluntly made in public

offering a solution and walking away

a constructive comment to help and a destructive one to hurt

I agree 100%!!!

Last week I bought a pair of shoes that I was so excited about. When I showed my friend, she flat out told me "Those are the ugliest pair of shoes I have ever seen! I can't believe you actually paid for those." We laughed for about 10 min. She is a great friend and I love her. I also love my new shoes :)


"Most of the TPBDC costumes are for sale or on the bodies of professional dancers. That's part of the criteria for posting." -I think this is a great rule btw.
 
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Aniseteph

New member
I don't care how fugly and half-assed a home made costume is if it is being worn in the right context ie. in the privacy of a student hafla or recital. If it's a friend and they are about to do something they will be mortified by in a few months time I'd make a tactful comment but mostly I would let them have fun and get on with it.

Go public in it, or put it on your YouTube channel, or sell it as a beautiful BD costume on eBay, and expect to be judged.
 

Nejmeh

New member
Uhhhh, not to try to be a peacemaker here, but I believe both yame and bellylove are making strong points and probably would agree totally if they could meet eye to eye. IMO your both talking about having the right to your own opinion and aestetics, and as a result, respect others in that. Both of you have stated some arguments a bit strong, but reading other posts of you, you both just have strong personalities. But imo it also seems you both got offended by the other and quickly backed up in your little corner. Seriously, to me it seems you are both talking about the same thing in basics...

OT: In my case, it`s not a case of unattractive, but more 'this is more appealing to me then that'(uh, clear?). For me, a more curved, older woman is more appealing to watch then a very skinny 16yr old. I can still watch the 16 yr old with the respect she earns and like what she does. I just would be more enchanted by the curved older woman.
I think it`s the same in everyday live. Different people have different taste. As for me, I have very specific looks, which somehow fits into most arab or oriental-look orientated westerners. And totally doesn`t fit into the traditional western preferences. So what?! Should I become insulted because friend x thinks blond, blue eyed girls are more attractive?(to him, and thats all someone is saying with such a statement) Should he become offended when I don`t find his dreamgirl all that special?

edit: ow wait, I do have one thing I really, really find appauling(and still, if people want to do it, fine by me, I just don`t want to watch): (big)armpit hair/belly hair. Call me narrow minded but thats just a bridge too far for me
 
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Belly Love

New member
Nejmeh - very thoughtful response. I admit, I'm definitely quick to be defensive in regards to this subject and have a strong opinion on it. Not that this excuses it, but I think it has a lot to do with being interested in fashion my whole life and being insulted & judged so many times from those who were not in that industry.

I know what your saying about hair- every culture is different. When I worked in the fashion industry it took me a while to get used to unshaven upper legs, which were very common among the eastern European models. Now I've seen it so many times that I don't think anything of it. The underarm hair is a completely different story...:)
 
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Nejmeh

New member
Nejmeh - very thoughtful response. I admit, I'm definitely quick to be defensive in regards to this subject and have a strong opinion on it. Not that this excuses it, but I think it has a lot to do with being interested in fashion my whole life and being insulted & judged so many times from those who were not in that industry.

I know what your saying about hair- every culture is different. When I worked in the fashion industry it took me a while to get used to unshaven upper legs, which were very common among the eastern European models. Now I've seen it so many times that I don't think anything of it. The underarm hair is a completely different story...:)

I understand, as I understand that yame will have her reasons to feel passionate about her feelings. You should read this tread after a couple of weeks or so, you`ll probably will be able to read it in a different light.;)

Hehe, here you go, as for me, I seriously don`t see any reasons to shave your upperlegs!(as a 'normal'woman, models are not my territory) And I also refuse to shave my arms(I have some light hair on my underarm, but not so see able) Indeed a cultural thingie I guess, as I once had a american friend comment me on that(i`m convinced she meant it nicely). My reply was that in that case I was happy living in holland:D
 

Cyriine

New member
@ Nejmeh,

Damn you and your light hair D=, try having beige skin but jet black hair everywhere D=.
I have to wax all over once a month because I can't STAND hair anywhere but my head and eyebrows and eyelashes =|
 

Yame

New member
OT: In my case, it`s not a case of unattractive, but more 'this is more appealing to me then that'(uh, clear?). For me, a more curved, older woman is more appealing to watch then a very skinny 16yr old. I can still watch the 16 yr old with the respect she earns and like what she does. I just would be more enchanted by the curved older woman.
I think it`s the same in everyday live. Different people have different taste. As for me, I have very specific looks, which somehow fits into most arab or oriental-look orientated westerners. And totally doesn`t fit into the traditional western preferences. So what?! Should I become insulted because friend x thinks blond, blue eyed girls are more attractive?(to him, and thats all someone is saying with such a statement) Should he become offended when I don`t find his dreamgirl all that special?

Very well-stated. I think it all comes down to the way we interpret a statement such as "I don't like such and such," and such a statement will illicit different reactions depending on how it is interpreted.

Sometimes, when someone says they don't like something, they mean they don't really care for it, or they don't particularly like it. But they can also mean they absolutely hate it and avoid it at all costs. Or, of course, anywhere in between these extremes.

It's very easy to misinterpret a statement like that in a forum when we don't know any background to the statement, the tone, etc. So in order to avoid these kinds of misinterpretations, I try to be careful about the way I word things. I think it's safer to talk about what you prefer, or to state the things you do like, than to list the things you don't like, because people reading that will usually default to the assumption that you have a strong aversion to the things you say you "don't like," which might offend them.
 

Greek Bonfire

Well-known member
@ Nejmeh,

Damn you and your light hair D=, try having beige skin but jet black hair everywhere D=.
I have to wax all over once a month because I can't STAND hair anywhere but my head and eyebrows and eyelashes =|

I feel your pain - I also am blessedly hirsute :(
 

LunaXJJ

New member
I don't care about appearance as far as body shape/size. I've seen good, and bad dancers of all sizes. I don't care about curvature either, some girls just don't carry weight in their chest or hips, I don't hold it against them.

The only thing I expect from a dancer appearance-wise is to dress well, and dance well. By that I mean professionals who are being paid to perform. If I were watching a practice video made by a beginner on youtube that would be different of course. However if I were paying to see a belly dance performance I'd expect the dancer to be dressed for the part, and present themselves well.

If that makes sense.
 

Shanazel

Moderator
A dark haired pale skinned friend had laser treatment on her legs and arms. She says it is "pricy" and took a year of treatments before she could throw out her razors, but she is delighted with the results. Won't work on me- not enough contrast between hair and skin.
 

Aniseteph

New member
It can do. I know somone who had her pits done - no more shaving! But as Shanazel says, it costs a bit and works best on pale skin/ dark hair.

<carries on with cheap supermarket razors>
 

Cyriine

New member
@Aniseteph Haha the Bic ones?

@Shanazel Lol, I might go for it actually. Pricey but worth it, it seems. I want baby butt skin D=
 
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