Sultan Acts

Andrea Deagon · 06-09-2009, 12:53 PM

Anybody still do Sultan acts out there? The thing with giving the guy a turban, dancing seductively, etc.? Maybe in belly grams?

I am interested in what reactions you observe in the "victim" and the audience. Do they get off on it? Are they embarrassed? Do they take it as an oppotunity to grope you (or try)? Is it good-natured on all sides or are there undercurrents you don't like?

When I came up, this was par for the course in a restaurant performance, but I gave it up when and where I could because I felt it was demeaning to me and to the dance. But then I see Birgul Beray do it, and it looks like a lot of good, clean fun. So I am interested in other people's experiences of it, past and present.

Amulya · 06-09-2009, 01:21 PM

It's so gimmicky, I hate it. It's fun to get people to dance with you, but anything else, blech. I already hate it when a dancer drapes her veil around someone, so anything more, not fun to me.

shiradotnet · 06-09-2009, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea Deagon

Anybody still do Sultan acts out there? The thing with giving the guy a turban, dancing seductively, etc.? Maybe in belly grams?

I am interested in what reactions you observe in the "victim" and the audience. Do they get off on it? Are they embarrassed? Do they take it as an oppotunity to grope you (or try)? Is it good-natured on all sides or are there undercurrents you don't like?

When I came up, this was par for the course in a restaurant performance, but I gave it up when and where I could because I felt it was demeaning to me and to the dance. But then I see Birgul Beray do it, and it looks like a lot of good, clean fun. So I am interested in other people's experiences of it, past and present.

I am not a fan of the Sultan act. I remember going to a workshop on how to do bellygrams and groaning inwardly when the instructor was coaching us to mime feeding grapes to the guest of honor.

The reason I dislike the sultan act thing is that it reinforces a stereotype that is very damaging to our dance in many ways. Especially if the dancer makes a big deal out of dancing seductively for him, unwrapping her veil for him, etc.

That said, I think a dancer who is good at comedy can do it in a non-icky way. Although I haven't seen Birgul's sultan act, I have seen her perform on two different occasions, and she is a skilled comedienne. So yes, I can easily imagine Birgul being capable of doing a good, clean fun flavor of sultan act.

I have been known to put a big tacky silver turban on a guest of honor's head, but then instead of dancing "for him" I got the party guests (both male and female) up to do a simple debke step in a circle around him. Or, there was the time I was performing at a nudist's birthday party and the ONLY garment he was wearing was the silly silver turban.... I have also been known to place the guest of honor's wife in a chair, and then make him get up and dance "for her". Anyway, because I turn it into a comedy act and stay far away from connotations of seduction, I've never had any issues with sleazy undercurrents. The guest of honor might be a bit embarrassed at being the center of attention, but in the same way he'd be embarrassed to be wearing a huge sombrero at a Mexican restaurant while everyone is singing "Happy birthday".

Andrea Deagon · 06-12-2009, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shiradotnet

The guest of honor might be a bit embarrassed at being the center of attention, but in the same way he'd be embarrassed to be wearing a huge sombrero at a Mexican restaurant while everyone is singing "Happy birthday".

Great perspective, makes perfect sense.

Here's my horror story. When I came back to the US in 1984 after living overseas for 3 years, I applied for a job at a "telegram" company. The owner (whom I had known when she was belly dancing herself) explained to me how to do the "Sultan Act" for the honoree. To conclude the performance, she said, "You stand behind him and do a shoulder shimmy leaning up against him, then use your veil to wipe the sweat off his bald head [were they all bald, I wonder?]. Then you sit in his lap and sing 'Happy Birthday.'"

Appalled, all I could do was stammer, "I ... I don't sing."

"Oh," she said brightly, "Then you can play a kazoo!"

I decided I would seek employment elsewhere.

BTW I should say that what Birgul does is not really a "Sultan Act" -- it is getting up a man to dance with her and taking him through a series of dance movements that are funny and good natured and also establish her technical mastery and complete control of the performance -- a loose and flowing control, but complete ... I guess a "Sultan Act" would be more dancing FOR the guy.

So now I wonder if anything like that ever does happen in the primary cultures or whether it is wholly our invention.

A clip:
YouTube - Birgül Beray 13

shiradotnet · 06-12-2009, 01:51 AM

Delilah (the one in Seattle) says she was the inventor of the bellygram.

Here is a thread on tribe.net in which she describes what she used to do "back in the day":

Belly Gram History - Ethnology & History of Mid-Eastern Dance - tribe.net

As for the primary cultures, I haven't seen anything like that myself on my trips to Egypt, but I'll defer to those who know more about the culture than I do....

Caroline_afifi · 06-12-2009, 09:43 AM

I have never heard of something called a bellygram in the Middle East, I think it is wholly a Western invention.

To be honest, it is not really something that exsists in the UK anymore.

We had a little novelty spate in the 80's, but now only exsists in small pockets and usually with a stripper.

Ranya · 06-12-2009, 03:03 PM

I second Caroline on this, there are no bellygrams over here nor are "sultan acts" even if it is a private party. The dancer might acknowledge the guest of honour but never in a way that could be compared to what a "sultan act" is in the western perception.

Shanazel · 06-13-2009, 02:29 AM

Closest I ever got was a gig where the guy who hired me to dance dressed up in robe and headcloth and presented himself to his guests as "Anwar Whetham, the Sheik of Swing." He was a friend of mine and had a gift for straight-faced clowning. Someone bet him that he wouldn't go to the local biker/cowboy bar dressed that way. It being Laramie, Wyoming in the 1970s, he not only went, he took me in full bedlah with him and got a third person to chauffeur this dreadful Lincoln Continental that belonged to someone's parents. We were young and silly and I still smile when I think of it.

Of course, no one asked me to sing or play a kazoo...

da Sage · 06-13-2009, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanazel

Closest I ever got was a gig where the guy who hired me to dance dressed up in robe and headcloth and presented himself to his guests as "Anwar Whetham, the Sheik of Swing." He was a friend of mine and had a gift for straight-faced clowning. Someone bet him that he wouldn't go to the local biker/cowboy bar dressed that way. It being Laramie, Wyoming in the 1970s, he not only went, he took me in full bedlah with him and got a third person to chauffeur this dreadful Lincoln Continental that belonged to someone's parents. We were young and silly and I still smile when I think of it.

A-haha - Awesome!

Aniseteph · 06-13-2009, 09:53 AM

Great story Shanazel!

As for the kazoo - WTF? Dignity, at all times Dignity. And I hope that veil is washable, eww...

maybe she thought it sounded like a mizmar, 'cos it does in a strange way...

06-09-2009, 12:53 PM	#1 (permalink)
Andrea Deagon Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Wilmington, NC Posts: 203	Sultan Acts Anybody still do Sultan acts out there? The thing with giving the guy a turban, dancing seductively, etc.? Maybe in belly grams? I am interested in what reactions you observe in the "victim" and the audience. Do they get off on it? Are they embarrassed? Do they take it as an oppotunity to grope you (or try)? Is it good-natured on all sides or are there undercurrents you don't like? When I came up, this was par for the course in a restaurant performance, but I gave it up when and where I could because I felt it was demeaning to me and to the dance. But then I see Birgul Beray do it, and it looks like a lot of good, clean fun. So I am interested in other people's experiences of it, past and present. __________________ "I am not contradictory, I am dispersed." (Roland Barthes)

06-09-2009, 01:21 PM	#2 (permalink)
Amulya Moderator Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Northern Rivers (NSW), Australia Posts: 2,793	It's so gimmicky, I hate it. It's fun to get people to dance with you, but anything else, blech. I already hate it when a dancer drapes her veil around someone, so anything more, not fun to me. __________________ The Belly Dance Video Clip Blog Blog: What Were They Thinking? Amulya on BellyDancingDiva

06-12-2009, 01:51 AM	#5 (permalink)
shiradotnet Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Iowa City, Iowa, USA Posts: 805	Delilah (the one in Seattle) says she was the inventor of the bellygram. Here is a thread on tribe.net in which she describes what she used to do "back in the day": Belly Gram History - Ethnology & History of Mid-Eastern Dance - tribe.net As for the primary cultures, I haven't seen anything like that myself on my trips to Egypt, but I'll defer to those who know more about the culture than I do.... __________________ www.shira.net and www.bellydanceplus.com, on twitter @shiradotnet

06-12-2009, 09:43 AM	#6 (permalink)
Caroline_afifi V.I.P. Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Liverpool UK Posts: 3,326	I have never heard of something called a bellygram in the Middle East, I think it is wholly a Western invention. To be honest, it is not really something that exsists in the UK anymore. We had a little novelty spate in the 80's, but now only exsists in small pockets and usually with a stripper.

06-12-2009, 03:03 PM	#7 (permalink)
Ranya Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Paris, FRANCE or Cairo, EGYPT or Bratislava, SLOVAKIA Posts: 779	I second Caroline on this, there are no bellygrams over here nor are "sultan acts" even if it is a private party. The dancer might acknowledge the guest of honour but never in a way that could be compared to what a "sultan act" is in the western perception.

06-13-2009, 02:29 AM	#8 (permalink)
Shanazel Moderator Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Rocky Mountains USA Posts: 8,558	Closest I ever got was a gig where the guy who hired me to dance dressed up in robe and headcloth and presented himself to his guests as "Anwar Whetham, the Sheik of Swing." He was a friend of mine and had a gift for straight-faced clowning. Someone bet him that he wouldn't go to the local biker/cowboy bar dressed that way. It being Laramie, Wyoming in the 1970s, he not only went, he took me in full bedlah with him and got a third person to chauffeur this dreadful Lincoln Continental that belonged to someone's parents. We were young and silly and I still smile when I think of it. Of course, no one asked me to sing or play a kazoo...

06-13-2009, 09:53 AM	#10 (permalink)
Aniseteph V.I.P. Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Sussex, England Posts: 3,289	Great story Shanazel! As for the kazoo - WTF? Dignity, at all times Dignity. And I hope that veil is washable, eww... maybe she thought it sounded like a mizmar, 'cos it does in a strange way...