Caroline_afifi

I cant get your quote up to respond to.

I think we have crossed wires here all round.
I was talking about me personally and how i struggle with fancy dress and my own thoughts on appearing elitist etc.
I agree with what you are saying.
The bit about the Tutu's confused me though. I was reffering to the possibility that some people maybe attracted to performing on stage just for the opportunity of wearing a costume if other opportunities dont arise.
It was just a thought.
Yes, there is a big difference between dressing for a haflah and being an audience member. I think we all said this though...didnt we?

The question about dressing up and the importance of it, was a genuine question to people about how much of the attraction to this dance (and perhaps others) is the chance to dress up? For some it maybe low down on the list and for others it maybe the top priority. I am still interested to know to what extent this inflences people.

Cathy, Thanks for your contribution on the subject and welcome back!

Oh..PS the 'Pro's i was reffering to are those in Egypt. You would never see anything from the bazaar on a well known dancer in Cairo.
Yes, Pro's around the world often do buy from the bazaars but I really dont personally know many. There is also a snobbery about this.

Aisha Azar

Dear Caroline,

lizaj

Well I did go on about respecting experience and not being offended to balance my fears but ho hum. Anyway water under bridge.


It's a rare hafla that is a proving ground for dancers around here. They are usually just parties and whilst some dancers like myself are serious, we will never be pro's for one reason or another.I'll perform at an event like this and straight away jump into jeans as I am uncomfortable sitting on sequins. But if an attendee who is not on the programme wants to wear her gear because she is going to bop at what is a party for belly dancers who am I to start going on about green rooms in a church hall or local community centre.
A staged theatre platform is very different and the silly moo audience member who comes along with even a hip scarf on is out of place as are the dancers arrive in costume,who don't behave back stage or don't attend to make-up hair etc. Even if my appearance on stage will not be for pay or not be followed up by the Royal Variety Gig, I will stll be entertaining people who have paid to see me.
That's where a professional attitude is necessary not at a hafla/party. I go to one held by one of this country's best teachers , a member of a dance company and all around fabulous dancer but she wants her students to have fun and encourages dress-up.
iIwant people to take belly dancing seriously as much as the next person but I also beive that hobbiest can just have fun at "closed" parties. They are NOT on view to the general public.

Aisha Azar

Dear Lizaj

[quote]I will let it be water under the bridge if you will. (Truce?)


Regardless, even amateurs need to be guided to have some standards, don't you think?

For me it is usually back into my dress because a costume is for stage, not for when I am sitting in the audience.


Haflas are supposed to be learning experiences as well as fun. The community center or the church hall becomes the stage and the house in which the dance show is taking place. It becomes the theatre! The idea is to teach students good dance ettiquette as well as sharing the dance itself and having fun.


It is one and the same when it comes to putting on any kind of entertainment. If I am dancing for an audience in my living room, whether it is other dancers or my grandmother or whoever, in order to give the dance its just dues, certain criteria must be followed..... One of them is making a clearly designated "stage" space, and so the dance becomes the entertainment, not me just fooling around in the living room. The moment I put on the costume and go out in front of anyone, I am calling attention to the fact that I am a dancer.

.

Whenever we dance in public in a costume, paid or otherwise, we are taking on the responsibility of entertaining people and there are just certain rules, just like in any other part of life. For one thing, at the point that we dress up like belly dancers, we inform the audience, public or private that we ARE belly dancers, by that act alone, before we so much as lift our rib cages to stride across the stage area in response to the opening phrases of our music.


-up.

One of the reasons to host haflas is to teach our students the rules of professionalism...... Why can't the participants dance and have fun without sitting in their costumes out in the audience? Dressing rooms are easy to create if there are none available. Never mind the wear and tear on a costume that is being sat down on!



ANY audience member is the general public. If I show up somewhere to see a dance show, public or private, I may be a professional dancer but when I sit in the audience, no one should be able to distinguish me from any other audience member as far as my occupation goes. In many dance shows, the public can easily be made up of family, friends and strangers and ALL observers need to know that we respect what is being done on stage enough to treat the stage as the stage and the house as the house, and not call attention to ourselves and away from the performers.

Regards,
A'isha

jenc

Ok that's what you think - others beg to differ. There is no chance for the vast majority of hobby dancers to get a paying job - on grounds of their being no restaurant or other dance opportunities, the level of teaching available, their talent and or commitment (at least tow of these applying to most dancers)
Haflas are all private parties as such. If you nare invited to another classes's hafla, you are expected to do at least one dance. Then afterwards everyone dances.
I personally am uncomfortable in jeans (too much belly) and don't see any pint in getting changed in the toilet after I have finished as I am going to be on the dance floor afterwards and haven't got a pro costume anyway.
Let the final word be that it our choice - as we ar the ones who know our own circustances!!

Caroline_afifi

I think perhpas the British scene is different from BD scenes in other countries.
A BD haflah usually means anyone can dress and this is the norm. Even when invited by another group there tends to be an understanding that it is a 'dressing up' opportunity. If only the people performing at the Haflahs were allowed to dress up then this could remove all opportunities for people in the UK., this was my concern. Bearing this in mind, I thought that some may perhaps put themselves out as a performer just for the chance to wear a great costume (this is different from being in an audience whcih is why i got confused about Tutu's).

I think everyone pretty much agree's so far that going to a theatre or any other venue (other than class haflahs) wearing Bedlah or Egyptian/Turkish themed costumes is not very cool and potentially makes the dance look ridiculous.

Am I right??

jenc

Absolutely!! I think everyone was clear on that. I just wanted to make sure that somone from the Uk had the last say on the UK scene.

Personally, I wish the UK was more professional, in terms of the dance I see, but I am also aware that if teachers wre more demanding, their classes would probably fold and I would have no chance to dance. Perhaps however, I will make this a new thread

Kharis

The UK dance scene is mostly struggling in the 'professional' bracket. As a teacher of 13 years, I understand that a teacher must put fun as an emphasis to learning in class to keep the numbers up....Hell, there's the Line Dance Belly Dance teachers who have massive classes because they teach bugger all and just bop around from side to side, making it more an exercise class than a class teaching the art of ME dance. But it depresses me when I attend any kind of performance platform, be it haflah or showcase, where the performers are uncoordinated, sloppy, badly dressed and poorly presented.

Haflahs in the UK are geared for having fun.... they enable all and sundry to dress up, chill out and show off what they've learned all year with no pressure whatsoever. Fair enough. A showcase, on the other hand, is a different ball game and should be the arena where performers are pushed to look and dance their absolute best.

But I do think that teachers should place more emphasis on making performances tighter and more professional looking no matter the platform. This is particularly relevant to troupes. I get sick of seeing bad troupe work, where none of the dancers know their steps, the costumes are thrown together and totally uncoordinated in colour and style, and the choreographies are dull and unimaginative.

Kharis

Just because Arabs choose to do this, doesn't mean it's de rigeur for everybody else in the belly dance world. I'm sorry but I really find this comment irritating. There's a certain 'looking down the nose' element to your statement which I know is not deliberate but which comes across that way. A haflah is a party - a get together - a social gathering. Why shouldn't people dress up? How stilted is a party when you cannot let your hair down and must conform to someone's ideal of what is 'acceptable'. Stuff that!

How the performers comport themselves during their slot is one thing... of course they must be as professional as possible during that performance slot, but hell, if they wanna come off afterwards, dress up and mingle with the crowd in the costume they've just danced in, why not?

I suspect that there are haflahs in the States where people do just this. I don't believe every haflah over your side is that anal.

Reen.Blom

Well to me it would be at the bottom of the list, although I do believe it is fun to dress up for the atmosphere! Especially if you can share it with your dance friends!

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