What is the funniest thing you have seen in relation to MED? - Page 4

Caroline_afifi · 06-24-2008, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by karena

Maybe that happens if you take it out of its context. I've never associated Irish/Scottish stuff with godesses, but I suppose if you are far from the source it takes on a mystical otherness.

Nah.. havent seen many goddesses walking around Glasgow recently,
Although I thought I nearly spotted one in the Barrowlands one afternoon!

Seriously though, I kinda know what Brea means about fusions etc. and how some people have had no training in either part of the fusion.
Where people are a 'fusion' themselves then I consider this different again (mixed parentage).
What is wrong with people with parents of two cultures enjoying each culture at the same time? it happens alot here. There are many many mixed marriages and art is for all.
This of course is different to the 'fusion' discussion and bad fusion is BAD fusion b ut when it is good it is very good.

lizaj · 06-24-2008, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by da Sage

For me, it depends on the cowboy.

nah nah nah nah nah...edited

lizaj · 06-24-2008, 10:31 PM

YouTube - Cat attacking Bellydancer

the cat got it right..it's that bl**dy song again..

Brea · 06-25-2008, 02:42 AM

I am probably not being entirely clear here. I love good fusion myself. It isn't that. It's that the goddessy thing happens to Scottish historians too, believe me! That is, assumption that Scottishness (or Celticness) is goddess-oriented. Does that make sense? Although since my thesis was on over-romanticizing Scottish culture maybe I'm a bit oversensitive.

I'm saying that much as we would like to see our dance's culture done justice it's the same for any other culture. If they're blended well there's no problem, but I often get that feeling that it's just the goddessy thing going on. That said, I once saw hula done to the bagpipes and that was not only impressive but had a historical background.

I certainly don't expect everyone to be a historian, but a nod to both sides of the coin would be nice. It is entirely possible that I am having trouble communicating this concept. Let me put it this way: when most people find out I study Scotland, they start in on me about Mists of Avalon and goddesses. Similar things happen when I say I bellydance. It's a complete assumption on my part but it's something that happens so often in my life that I worry a bit.

Caroline_afifi · 06-25-2008, 09:26 AM

I think perhaps what you are talking about happens more outside the UK than within it. We do have a crystal healing, Celtic design, goddess type of tourism but it happens from Glastonbury in the South to the Shetlands.

Alot of people in the UK have never been to Scotland, can you believe this?

lizaj · 06-25-2008, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caroline_afifi

I think perhaps what you are talking about happens more outside the UK than within it. We do have a crystal healing, Celtic design, goddess type of tourism but it happens from Glastonbury in the South to the Shetlands.

Alot of people in the UK have never been to Scotland, can you believe this?

A lot of English people have never been either. I've only been 3 times and I am a Liverpool Scot!

Reen.Blom · 06-25-2008, 12:16 PM

I think it is due to the popularity of celtic mythology.... and what other way to "get a feel of it" than fusing the dance? It does not take to be historian, cos most ppl's attitude is playing the fairy tale (just like with many bellydance shows-just a fantasy)...

On theother hand... me oh my ...dont mention the goddess thing to be... I dunno why on earth it irritates me so much...lol

Brea · 06-25-2008, 03:39 PM

Reen- yes, but this 'popular Celtic mythology' is, for the most part, as false as when you read bellydance books all about 'the goddess'. That's the problem I have with it. The amount of totally unchecked misinformation out there! People think that just because it's in a book it must be true. Well, look at all these people writing 'autobiographies' that turn out to be fiction (and ruin it for the rest of us who'd like to one day tell their story, and won't be believed). Although the autobiographies are exposed in the media, all this Celtic mysticism sure isn't, and neither is the goddess thing with bellydance. I like to think publishers are a little bit more responsible than that, but apparently not.

Yes, I run into people all the time in England who have never been to Scotland! That is mystifying to me. You're right, I think that goddess association is generally an outside-of-the-UK thing, but not always. To be honest, most people I run into who are like this are people who've never set foot in Scotland at all. In fact, I have to admit that when I first visited Scotland it was like having a bucket of ice water dumped over my head. I was taken in by the romanticism too, which is why I now write about it. I came to love Scotland as it was, not as I imagined it to be. Although, for me, it was unrelated to goddess culture.

As an American and Scottish historian, that's the basis I'm going off of (that is, running into Americans who think this way). Oddly enough, in Cape Breton, where I used to live, I found none of that goddessy stuff. The Wiccans I met there knew their Scottish history very well and it was nowhere near tied up in mysticism.

I think that people have a tendency to 'other' or 'orientalize' certain cultures as being ancient and more earth-connected than their own. It's amazing how prevalent it is. I've seen it now with bellydance, with Scotland, and with Hawai'i. I'm curious if the rest of you, who probably are familiar with other cultures, have seen this happen elsewhere. I'd love to hear about it, as 'othering' is sort of my academic interest at the moment.

Caroline_afifi · 06-25-2008, 05:29 PM

I find that romanticism is also related to ancestory.
I assume you studied Scotland because it is related to your roots?
I am just trying think what relevance this would have in America or Hawaii, do you have Scottish type studies for career purposes?

I hear many people here in the UK talk about their 'home' countries like they were some sort of Utopia and the best thing since sliced bread.

I think the bucket of icy cold water was probably the weather as everything else about Scotland is pretty great. I really love it and have since my very first visit. I suppose for me there was no culture shock involved. What shocked you the most and burst your bubble?

Liverpool has strong root connections to Ireland and it is often reffered to as the capital of Ireland but I feel there is also an over romantic ideal too somewhere.

Sara · 06-25-2008, 05:45 PM

Aye, I was about to say. Ireland, Wales, and Scotland all are what I expected of them, but perhaps thats because I grew up here. There was no culture shock for me. I dunt think I really have any fantasy either, but I do study Ancient British history so I suppose I think more history minded about these countries than fantasy. Having said that, I don't think there's much illusion about any of these countries here. Up North at least.

06-25-2008, 02:42 AM	#34 (permalink)
Brea V.I.P. Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: USA Posts: 1,283	I am probably not being entirely clear here. I love good fusion myself. It isn't that. It's that the goddessy thing happens to Scottish historians too, believe me! That is, assumption that Scottishness (or Celticness) is goddess-oriented. Does that make sense? Although since my thesis was on over-romanticizing Scottish culture maybe I'm a bit oversensitive. I'm saying that much as we would like to see our dance's culture done justice it's the same for any other culture. If they're blended well there's no problem, but I often get that feeling that it's just the goddessy thing going on. That said, I once saw hula done to the bagpipes and that was not only impressive but had a historical background. I certainly don't expect everyone to be a historian, but a nod to both sides of the coin would be nice. It is entirely possible that I am having trouble communicating this concept. Let me put it this way: when most people find out I study Scotland, they start in on me about Mists of Avalon and goddesses. Similar things happen when I say I bellydance. It's a complete assumption on my part but it's something that happens so often in my life that I worry a bit. __________________ www.breamorgiane.com

06-25-2008, 12:16 PM	#37 (permalink)
Reen.Blom V.I.P. Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Between Heaven and Earth Posts: 2,263	I think it is due to the popularity of celtic mythology.... and what other way to "get a feel of it" than fusing the dance? It does not take to be historian, cos most ppl's attitude is playing the fairy tale (just like with many bellydance shows-just a fantasy)... On theother hand... me oh my ...dont mention the goddess thing to be... I dunno why on earth it irritates me so much...lol __________________ Join WORLD BELLY DANCE DAY! www.worldbellydanceday.com

06-25-2008, 03:39 PM	#38 (permalink)
Brea V.I.P. Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: USA Posts: 1,283	Reen- yes, but this 'popular Celtic mythology' is, for the most part, as false as when you read bellydance books all about 'the goddess'. That's the problem I have with it. The amount of totally unchecked misinformation out there! People think that just because it's in a book it must be true. Well, look at all these people writing 'autobiographies' that turn out to be fiction (and ruin it for the rest of us who'd like to one day tell their story, and won't be believed). Although the autobiographies are exposed in the media, all this Celtic mysticism sure isn't, and neither is the goddess thing with bellydance. I like to think publishers are a little bit more responsible than that, but apparently not. Yes, I run into people all the time in England who have never been to Scotland! That is mystifying to me. You're right, I think that goddess association is generally an outside-of-the-UK thing, but not always. To be honest, most people I run into who are like this are people who've never set foot in Scotland at all. In fact, I have to admit that when I first visited Scotland it was like having a bucket of ice water dumped over my head. I was taken in by the romanticism too, which is why I now write about it. I came to love Scotland as it was, not as I imagined it to be. Although, for me, it was unrelated to goddess culture. As an American and Scottish historian, that's the basis I'm going off of (that is, running into Americans who think this way). Oddly enough, in Cape Breton, where I used to live, I found none of that goddessy stuff. The Wiccans I met there knew their Scottish history very well and it was nowhere near tied up in mysticism. I think that people have a tendency to 'other' or 'orientalize' certain cultures as being ancient and more earth-connected than their own. It's amazing how prevalent it is. I've seen it now with bellydance, with Scotland, and with Hawai'i. I'm curious if the rest of you, who probably are familiar with other cultures, have seen this happen elsewhere. I'd love to hear about it, as 'othering' is sort of my academic interest at the moment. __________________ www.breamorgiane.com Last edited by Brea; 06-25-2008 at 03:43 PM.

06-25-2008, 05:45 PM	#40 (permalink)
Sara V.I.P. Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Wales/Yorkshire Posts: 1,160	Aye, I was about to say. Ireland, Wales, and Scotland all are what I expected of them, but perhaps thats because I grew up here. There was no culture shock for me. I dunt think I really have any fantasy either, but I do study Ancient British history so I suppose I think more history minded about these countries than fantasy. Having said that, I don't think there's much illusion about any of these countries here. Up North at least. __________________ With a little bit of this and a little bit of that, now shake your bum.... :P

06-24-2008, 10:31 PM	#33 (permalink)
lizaj Moderator Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: UK Posts: 1,266	YouTube - Cat attacking Bellydancer the cat got it right..it's that bl**dy song again..

06-25-2008, 09:26 AM	#35 (permalink)
Caroline_afifi V.I.P. Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Liverpool UK Posts: 1,335	I think perhaps what you are talking about happens more outside the UK than within it. We do have a crystal healing, Celtic design, goddess type of tourism but it happens from Glastonbury in the South to the Shetlands. Alot of people in the UK have never been to Scotland, can you believe this?

06-25-2008, 05:29 PM	#39 (permalink)
Caroline_afifi V.I.P. Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Liverpool UK Posts: 1,335	I find that romanticism is also related to ancestory. I assume you studied Scotland because it is related to your roots? I am just trying think what relevance this would have in America or Hawaii, do you have Scottish type studies for career purposes? I hear many people here in the UK talk about their 'home' countries like they were some sort of Utopia and the best thing since sliced bread. I think the bucket of icy cold water was probably the weather as everything else about Scotland is pretty great. I really love it and have since my very first visit. I suppose for me there was no culture shock involved. What shocked you the most and burst your bubble? Liverpool has strong root connections to Ireland and it is often reffered to as the capital of Ireland but I feel there is also an over romantic ideal too somewhere.