khanjar

Given that BD might not have ancient roots, is of no consequence, I am not seeking this for the history, my speculation on that is a side interest as happens with me and activities I develop an interest for. I am into this primarily and initially for the maintenance of flexibility I do see in the dance, but there has now become other reasons, or perhaps they could be called positive by products which propel my interest further. Where I was in the past not altogether sure if I should try this, now there is a change, I really want to do this, and will.

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Reen.Blom

Go Khanjar!

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Aniseteph

Aww look, it's on a DVD, it must be true...

YouTube - Mia Serra on the origin of belly dance

I wonder what the sources were for all this info.

jenc

she's the one who learnt to bellydance on a retreat with a sufi mystic - so I suppose he told her
or not!!!!

Yasmine Bint Al Nubia

Actually some of the info is documented in other places..such as the Romany Trail Part I and II. The Ottoman Empire also played a part in cementing the dance as well as the Ghawazee of Egypt all played roles into what we call bellydance today. However, one still can't point to ONE singular historical event.

But if one would listen very closely, the dialogue still contained some biased remarks in describing the dances as 'mysterious', 'exotic' etc. A carryover form Orientalism perhaps?
Yasmine

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Aisha Azar

Dear Gang,
All I can say is that in the first two minutes of that clip, I hear enough to make me turn it off as really twisted history and logic.
- What are the ancient cultures where women had very high status because they could give birth and they did ancient goddess rituals?

_ When the Gypsies moved into Egypt their dance became known as the "Ghawazi"?????? I beg to differ. The Ghawazi were a group of people, not a dance. The Arabic word means sort of like "to be enamored" and I am not sure when they begin to be called that, but it would seem that she is confusing the people who do the dance with the dance. They were also called "Nawar" or Gypsy.The Ghawazi do 7 different styles of dance according to Edwina Nearing, and they refer to their dances as "Dance of the people", and if memory serves, that is quoting Khyriyah Mazin. I can look it up in the original Habibi articles if anyone cares to know.

- There are many,many types of dance,both in and out of the Middle East that have the same movements or the same root movements. This does not make them all belly dance. The dance goes far beyond movement in order to be what it is; a point often overlooked by people trying to make the "ancient" connection. Dance is more than just a few movements, and this dance IS easily traceable to the 20 th century.


After that I had to quit listening....
Regards,
A'isha

lizaj

Dear God. Who is this lady and where does she get her info and how did she manage to get it in that kind of a mess.

Aniseteph

Well quite, that was my (sketchy) understanding - there is evidence for population movements, and dates when dancers were banned/exiled from cities, but how can anyone tell what dances they were doing, or say they were bringing "belly dance" with them? Or attribute the "roots" of belly dance to just one group rather than from a more complex cultural mix? (especially if you are talking about the whole of the ME being involved, and the Ottoman Empire was biiig, and trading links...)

Ancient dance brought by those mysterious romantic gypsies from their far eastern origins, with a dollop of ancient goddess-worshipping thrown in. Pretty story but IMO if you aren't getting scholarly with the evidence it should all be prefixed with that old advertising cop-out "Believed By Many... ".

But then if I ever did a DVD it would not sell

(I'm still getting over the advice to find an uncluttered space to practice. LOL. Dream on...)

Brea

Yes, it seems the truth, while out there, does not sell. I've seen many a crestfallen student when I've told them the history of the dance. Some of them go on believing their own story anyway.

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lizaj

Right Ok then tell me the history...