jenc

I don't think that the UK is doing so well. I am particularly worried about gender differntiation for children. Pink princesses BRATS . There is so much girly stuff around that gender lines seem to be getting tighter. Yes men now take more care of themselves with better grooming, but this is just a cosmetic change in more ways than the obvious ie it is a surface change.

Caroline_afifi

I agree with you Jenc.
Women drinking pints and men dancing is nothing to do with societies expectations of men and women. Things are changeing and have changed and the years and the lines have become more blurred. Through many years of unemployment etc. the male role has diminished and has become less defined.
Studies have shown that this is half way responsible for the rise in aggressive attacks and domestic violence. Women have always been hard workers and laborers and have always been able to fight and defend. Equality is not about mimicing each others behaviour or sharing the same interests, it is much deeper than that.

lizaj

Damn !!!the grand daughter loves pink. However Barbie or Bratz appear to have been either banned or sidetracked by her mother in favour of puppies.

Sara

I was trying to explain that stereotpyes of what genders must and mustn't like are influenced by what that particular sex do or don't generally like.

I think all these Barbies and Bratz are nothing compared to Playboy! My cousin bless her, was desperate for a Playboy compact set thing for her 9th birthday! It's everywhere. Pens, notebooks, chairs, computer mice pads. Hate Playboy.

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Brea

You know, I've noticed that in the states too. A lot more 'princess', pinks, that kind of thing. Very bizarre. At my friend's kid's elementary school, they had a party one day where the girls HAD to dress up as princesses and put on makeup and nail polish (these were five year olds), and the boys were weightlifting.

This is kind of what I mean. It starts so young you don't even realize you're being told to like something. Conditioning happens all around us and it just bugs the ****!! out of me. When I took a media persuasion class, the very first thing our teacher said was "The thoughts you have are not your own." It's creepy once you start to notice how prevalent it is, like a continous whisper.

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Shanazel

Sorry, kiddo, the chest hair thing is probably not going to happen, though when my son and half a dozen of his friends gather at the house there is enough testosterone in the atmosphere for one to get a contact high.

Being the only member of the non-represented sex in any field gives one a unique point of view. In retrospect, I wouldn't change my past experiences as the lone woman in my former field. It was intersting, challenging, if not always comfortable or companionable. I got a unique education and so did the guys with whom I worked. Even so, I understand the pleasure you took in seeing men dance in Egypt. The first time I worked with a female crew was amazing.

khanjar

So, what is the source of all this social disharmony, surely it cannot just be the fact that we are people and we will never change, there has to be an influence that perpetuates the problems, perhaps creates problems even where there should be none.

What about marketing, I mentioned before about the cosmetic industries causing a change, be it a surface change, but a change none the less.

Could it be, we as a society are being controlled and manipulated by industry, clever marketing creating a need and feeding the need and stuff the consequences as money matters more ?

Marketing always has been a science which incorporates human psychology and understanding how a social group thinks is the key to marketing. Marketing takes aim at social groups, not individuals, as groups are the most profitable and they have the ability to influence.

How many activities has one seen that as soon as commercial interests take hold, that activity, music being a good example, rapidly expands out of all proportion and often takes on guises that were never meant ?

Guns and knife crime, why is it that has increased, why do people, children even, seem to think a weapon is a must have?

From what I hear, the last knife amnesty in Britain, the only people that benefited from that were the cutlers, all those kitchen knives having to be replaced and with ease,( a kitchen knife being the most popular knife handed to the police)

Could it be that marketing is responsible for a lot of the ills in society and there the same misunderstandings we seem to have ?

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Caroline_afifi

Phew.. what a question!
I feel that generally there is a distinct lack of postive role models for young people. Popular media does not help with all the latest 'must haves' etc. what about the 'have nots'?
We have a huge problem amongst young men and women in the UK. High rates of teenage pregnancy, smoking, knife crime, alcohol abuse and anti-social behaviour etc. Young people are literally killing each other.
Some of the images in musicare based around hard men and sexy girls (ho's) the music and youth culture is a large part, along with X BOX etc. Grand Theft Auto games and the rest.
Of course there has to be more to it than that as all the boys I knew played cow boys and Indians and weilded bows and arrow and guns etc. but turned out OK.
Unfortunately we grew up in Thatchers Britain which destroyed local communites and invented the Yuppy. Most turned to enterprise of dog eat dog including selling drugs and dealing weapons.
Football and rock music used to be the way out of the Ghetto, now it is selling drugs and bagging yourself a footballer.
For the working classes, the band Pulp said it best in the late 90's.. 'We drink, we dance and we screw cos there is F*** all else to do' its still true.

khanjar

Yes, that is a point, when I was younger, cowboys and indians was the game, and yes everyone I knew turned out ok, and I grew up near Liverpool in the eighties where there was no hope with near on one in four out of work. Rubbish job to rubbish job and very low pay, but I didn't turn to drugs and crime, neither did those I knew, so what happened? All I can think of, is what has happened since, where has the violence come from ?

Then we have tv now, terrestrial tv I am thinking, what is on tv, well there are sitcoms where males are made out to be stupid, fly on the wall people watching programmes, soaps where reality is twisted, too many police programmes where they appear constantly to be prosecuting people and this latest thing, 'The Apprentice ' and the like, that is appalling that programme and it's popular, why ? Is this indicative of our nation, if it is, then I can see the rot.

Where I used to live I learned something about crime and children, that was that some children think nothing about committing crime, as there is no one to stop them. I am not talking petty crime here, but car theft, underage driving and that recklessly, destruction of property and assault, adult crimes. The police, pretty useless in the fact that they were even scared to deal with fourteen year olds, because fourteen year olds knew their rights better than anyone and the justice system is incapable in that anyone the police try to prosecute generally gets let off with at worst, an anti social behaviour order which the police are meant to control, but can't because children know their rights. Plus the fact that p.c. plod knows children carry weapons and appear not afraid to use them and with that a lone copper always will think twice about his actions, as it is not worth risking loss of life or injury for someone that seems above the law.

So, society is rotting, going backwards, the lawless kids what will they become I wonder. I cannot help thinking this over emphasis on a person's human rights and the associated sychophants have something to do with it, as often public order and human rights do not coincide.

So, what does this mean for the rest of, those of us who just want to get along with each other and enjoy social gatherings where we may engage in dance of all things, without fear of segregation and abuse ?

Society is changing, but not all in the same direction at the same time, maybe it is that fragmentation of societal groups is the only way forward, those of us who want to get along go one way and leave the rest to it?

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Aniseteph

I read something recently about a woman in S London who works with problem kids and puts the knife culture and all the aggression is down to lousy parenting - they are brought up so badly with no one taking proper care of them or setting boundaries etc. that they are like cornered animals ready to attack at the slightest perceived threat, eg someone looking at them "funny". And once there's an element behaving like this it spreads to the less disturbed ones who then think they need knives for protection.

And before they get old enough to get a bit of sense and maturity they are off breeding more feral kids.