Sexism - Page 9

Caroline_afifi · 03-07-2008, 05:01 PM

People are also extremely afraid to question anyone of Middle Eastern Origin about their dancing or lack of it. As an organsier of some significant festivals I often come accross dancers who feel the have the divine right to be there because they are Middle Eastern. I have no fear about being accused of racism, anyone dare pull that one on me is making one assumption too many themselves.
I believe in supporting people of Middle Eastern origin to reach their full potential as an artist as I think there are more issues for them to deal with, but that is as far as it goes.

Aisha Azar · 03-07-2008, 05:18 PM

As a person who has had Arabs as my closest friends for the last 25 years or so, I would say that one big issue is that Arabs, unless they know people pretty well, are not necessarily going to say what they think, feel, know, to just anyone. The societal issues that make it a private and a communal culture at the same time, tend to discourage really frank discussion except under circumstances of closeness, I think. This has been my main experience, though there have been some exceptions.
Then, on the western side, there is the tendency to want to believe everything they say. One of my tried and true tests is that if I hear something consistently from people that I know pretty well, who are not related to each other, then I might think of taking it pretty seriously.
An example: I have heard that in some Gulf countries the thobe is called Thobe Tawoose. I have heard consistently that it means "Peacock dress", and I beleive this is the true translation. I have also heard the garment called "Thobe Neshel", and most of the Arabs that I know, even those from the Gulf say they do not know what the word Neshel means. one guy told me it means
"Embroidered dress". I am reserving judgement on accepting this as the meaning until I have more evidence that it is true. The guy might ahve just been trying to impress me with how smart he is or something!
Regards,
A'isha

Caroline_afifi · 03-07-2008, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A'isha Azar

As a person who has had Arabs as my closest friends for the last 25 years or so, I would say that one big issue is that Arabs, unless they know people pretty well, are not necessarily going to say what they think, feel, know, to just anyone. The societal issues that make it a private and a communal culture at the same time, tend to discourage really frank discussion except under circumstances of closeness, I think. This has been my main experience, though there have been some exceptions.
Then, on the western side, there is the tendency to want to believe everything they say.
A'isha

Yes, generally I would say this is about right.
Artists are often a different breed altogther though and this is what I am reffering too. I dont want to generalise as I definately dont mean all artists.
It is just a reference to my experience of a crazy few.

Tarik Sultan · 03-07-2008, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caroline_afifi

He was touring the Uk with workshops and I am going back to about 96/97.

He really did think he was the authority on womens dance and 'manhandled'
us quite a bit. that was of course unless you were over 40 and over weight.
I cant stand it when people accept the money but not the person. It makes me sooooo mad. Where is respect for human beings? Globally this dance economy is kept ticking by the over the 40 and over weight and we should all remember that. By the way, I have just hit 40 and I am an English size 10 (us8)
so I am not defending myself here.

The nerve of some people! How could he so tottally neglect the older crowd? Where is his sense of character decency, morals, professionalism?

Well, God willing I'll be in the UK next year with Morocco teaching for Afra. And because I am a man or morals, integrity, and professionalism I promise you with all sincerity that I will feel up the over weight over 40 women as well as the young and skinny girls. In my class, everyone gets treated equally, feel one person up you gatta feel them all up! After all, my mother raised me to be a gentleman!

Caroline_afifi · 03-07-2008, 07:32 PM

Your a hoot Tarik!

On a more serious note, the pressure is on these days to look young and slim or you are worth nothing.
What are men doing these days to combat age?
I hear more main are turning to cosmetic surgery these days.

Reen.Blom · 03-07-2008, 07:47 PM

Reply to OP:

Is it not a bit like with racism? Some people are so against racism that they actually encourage and approve the reverse-racism.... so what is it called reverse- sexism? LOL

I am not an equalist. I am a PERSONALITY out of genger or other boundaries. Maybe my personality is influenced by my being a female... (I do get PMS...LOL) but I am a person above enything else. And I do treat others as a PERSONALITY, not according to gender, race or whatever else.

And no I am not trying to prove that I am more of a man than of a woman, or that I have the right to be, or vice versa. I am not worried about THAT. (coming from the girl who spent her childhood hanging from trees and bouncing from roof to roof... Also fighting both boys and girls for the right to be what i want to be..) All that does not matter.

When we all start seing the best in each other, then this world will be a better place. Till then it stays "something-ist".

Hugs

PS Tarik, you forgot to mention that you are also modest. *giggles and runs away before Tarik got mad at her*

03-07-2008, 05:18 PM	#82 (permalink)
Aisha Azar V.I.P. Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Pacific Northwest USA Posts: 4,462	Dance etc. As a person who has had Arabs as my closest friends for the last 25 years or so, I would say that one big issue is that Arabs, unless they know people pretty well, are not necessarily going to say what they think, feel, know, to just anyone. The societal issues that make it a private and a communal culture at the same time, tend to discourage really frank discussion except under circumstances of closeness, I think. This has been my main experience, though there have been some exceptions. Then, on the western side, there is the tendency to want to believe everything they say. One of my tried and true tests is that if I hear something consistently from people that I know pretty well, who are not related to each other, then I might think of taking it pretty seriously. An example: I have heard that in some Gulf countries the thobe is called Thobe Tawoose. I have heard consistently that it means "Peacock dress", and I beleive this is the true translation. I have also heard the garment called "Thobe Neshel", and most of the Arabs that I know, even those from the Gulf say they do not know what the word Neshel means. one guy told me it means "Embroidered dress". I am reserving judgement on accepting this as the meaning until I have more evidence that it is true. The guy might ahve just been trying to impress me with how smart he is or something! Regards, A'isha

03-07-2008, 07:47 PM	#86 (permalink)
Reen.Blom V.I.P. Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Between Heaven and Earth Posts: 2,262	Reply to OP: Is it not a bit like with racism? Some people are so against racism that they actually encourage and approve the reverse-racism.... so what is it called reverse- sexism? LOL I am not an equalist. I am a PERSONALITY out of genger or other boundaries. Maybe my personality is influenced by my being a female... (I do get PMS...LOL) but I am a person above enything else. And I do treat others as a PERSONALITY, not according to gender, race or whatever else. And no I am not trying to prove that I am more of a man than of a woman, or that I have the right to be, or vice versa. I am not worried about THAT. (coming from the girl who spent her childhood hanging from trees and bouncing from roof to roof... Also fighting both boys and girls for the right to be what i want to be..) All that does not matter. When we all start seing the best in each other, then this world will be a better place. Till then it stays "something-ist". Hugs PS Tarik, you forgot to mention that you are also modest. giggles and runs away before Tarik got mad at her __________________ Join WORLD BELLY DANCE DAY! www.worldbellydanceday.com

03-07-2008, 05:01 PM	#81 (permalink)
Caroline_afifi V.I.P. Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Liverpool UK Posts: 1,285	People are also extremely afraid to question anyone of Middle Eastern Origin about their dancing or lack of it. As an organsier of some significant festivals I often come accross dancers who feel the have the divine right to be there because they are Middle Eastern. I have no fear about being accused of racism, anyone dare pull that one on me is making one assumption too many themselves. I believe in supporting people of Middle Eastern origin to reach their full potential as an artist as I think there are more issues for them to deal with, but that is as far as it goes.

03-07-2008, 07:32 PM	#85 (permalink)
Caroline_afifi V.I.P. Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Liverpool UK Posts: 1,285	Your a hoot Tarik! On a more serious note, the pressure is on these days to look young and slim or you are worth nothing. What are men doing these days to combat age? I hear more main are turning to cosmetic surgery these days.