Aisha Azar

Dear Reen,
The other side of that coin is that she gives a completely false impression of what the dance is.... and that is never a positive thing. She is NOT a belly dancer. She is a woman who uses a few torso and hip movements that are found in dances from around the world. Belly dance is a very specific dance. Movement is not so specific.
Regards,
A'isha

Kharmine

RB, my own dance teacher knows who taught Shakira the moves, and that person is supposed to be a belly dance teacher (I'll ask her sometime who the person is). So I can't say the moves don't have actual belly dance origins.

But Shakira herself says she is not a belly dancer and has even denied studying bally dance, I believe (she claims the moves just come naturally, I guess because of her Arabic heritage).

So she's not actually promoting belly dance so much as displaying some of its elements. She uses some of the moves for her own particular dance fusion, and it looks good. But if she threw some flamenco or ballet into her performances no one could really say that that made her a flamenco dancer or a ballerina, either.

Other people who perform gymnastic moves or choreographed ice skating to music do the same thing. We don't call them dancers, although they may use a strong, specific dance element.

I don't think anyone is putting Shakira down by saying she's not doing belly dance -- she's a highly talented entertainer who mixes and matches, and if that helped lure you into studying belly dance yourself I think that's terrific.

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nicknack

Aisha the specific performance that Reen was referring to was this YouTube - Ojos Asi, Shakira, it's not that bad a representation, and it's obviously not a Latin inspired performance.... so you've got to give some leeway on that one.

The problem is "bellydance" is still a mystery to a lot of people, Shakira's done mariachi, tango, reggaton, hip hop inspired pieces but all anyone can ever think is "bellydance".... it's another type of typecasting

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Cause I'm not here to let you down. But the costume makes the clown.

Aisha Azar

Dear Nicknack,
It IS a bad representation!!! Sorry, but a few ineffective arm movements, a poor stance for some sloppy Basic Egyptian movements and some shimmies that are not balanced properly, and those HORRIBLE choo-choo movements, is not belly dance. Especially when taken in context with every other element of the song and dance that is going on there. Her voice is fabulous, but her dance is not belly dance. It is something that she is doing that utilizes some movements that are seen in many styles of dance. All I can say is I hope people don't let a coin belt fool them, because without them she's got nothing as far as belly dance goes, whether or not she learned it from Bozenka. Belly dance is far more than a few poorly executed movements.
Regards,
A'isha

nicknack

I never implied that she was professional, but I've seen far worse from some restaraunt dancers (probably hired on the cheap)... and at least some of her movements have improved since then (although I wish the posture would).... I wasn't keeping an eagle eye on the technique though, I thought she was just having fun... not taking herself seriously, I mean this was a period where her dancing was limited to the ojos asi routine, the robot, and a few unchoreographed moves elsewhere.

You can live safe in the fact though that there are a good number of bellydancers out on the official fan forums who know what they're talking about and do often set people straight (I'm speaking from experience as the uber fan of the east midlands), so not all is lost when it comes to informing the public. If I was going complain about a bad representation I'd start with a far worse one in this country, in the north west (won't mention any names but a few on this forum will know who I'm talking about).... This is what I meant by it not being that bad.

__________________
Cause I'm not here to let you down. But the costume makes the clown.

Aisha Azar

Dear Nicknack,
I agree that there are many people calling themselves belly dancers out there, who do not live up to the title they are claiming for themselves. At the same time, this does not give Shakira any more legitimacy as a belly dancer than they have, nor make her a good representation for the dance. Her singing voice on the other hand, is pretty flawless, rich, full of nuance, feeling and truth. Even those times I think her lyrics are juvenile I get what she is emoting because it is real for her and because she has great talent as a singer. I just wish she would get over this "belly dance" image she is trying to put out there.
Regards,
A'isha

Reen.Blom

I never said that Shakira is a bellydancer, nor said that she says WHAT she does is bellydancing, so she does not promote it in words, but her moves definitly have roots in bellydance and in this way she DOES promote bellydance.

(I am sure that I have read in her interview that she said that she took bellydance classes and that bellydance helped her to overcome shyness).(I also took classes but i do not claim that I am a bellydancer YET)

Other thing is that there will always be someone to misinterpret and blame her for using Bellydance Elements in her shows. I personally like it .

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Reen.Blom

I think in this particular song she is turning to her roots and even I think sings a verse in arabic. Ok let us say that accoding to bellydance standard she is NOT a good bellydancer, but the moves whe uses look good on her as part of the fusion.

Say if she would use a flamenco piece in her routine then it would not make her a flamenco dancer indeed, or a GOOD flamenco dancer. But as long as she does not clame to be one, its ok with me.

And besides among people that like her art it surely WILL promote bellydance or flamenco for that matter.

Love,
Reen.Blom
*hi-five Nicknack*

Here is the lyrics... Still have to Google the meaning of Arabic part...LOL

Ojos Asi
Ayer conocí un cielo sin sol
y un hombre sin suelo
un santo en prisión
y una canción triste sin dueño

ya he ya he ya la he
y conocí tus ojos negros
ya he ya he ya la he
y ahora si que no
puedo vivir sin ellos

le pido al cielo solo un deseo
que en tus ojos yo pueda vivir
he recorrido ya el mundo entero
y una cosa te vengo a decir
viaje de Bahrein hasta Beirut
fui desde el norte al polo sur
y no encontré ojos así
como los que tienes tu

rabboussamai fikarrajaii
fi ainaiha aralhayati
ati ilaika min haza ikaaouni
arjouka labbi labbi nidai
viaje de Bahrein hasta Beirut
fui desde el norte hasta el polo sur
y no encontré ojos así
como los que tienes tu

ayer vi pasar una mujer
debajo de su camello
un río de sal un barco
abandonado en el desierto
ya he ya he ya la he
y conocí tus ojos negros
ya he ya he ya la he
y ahora si que no
puedo vivir sin ellos
le pido al cielo solo un deseo
que en tus ojos yo pueda vivir
he recorrido ya el mundo entero
y una cosa te vengo a decir
viaje de Bahrein hasta Beirut
fui desde el norte al polo sur
y no encontré ojos así
como los que tienes tu
le pido al cielo solo un deseo
que en tus ojos yo pueda vivir
he recorrido ya el mundo entero
y una cosa te vengo a decir
viaje de Bahrein hasta Beirut
fui desde el norte al polo sur
y no encontré ojos así
como los que tienes tu

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belly_dancer

I read I think in Habibi... (not sure... but it WAS is a belly dance publication) that she took classes I THINK @ Tamalyn Dalahl's (oops BAD spelling... someone PLEASE correct!!!) studios... in Florida... pretty sure Bozenka was one of Tamalyn's students....
& if i recall.... Shakira never claimed to be a belly dancer... only influenced by her heritage......
& because of her... alot of people have become more interested....

Aisha Azar

Dear Belly_dancer,
The questions remains, what, exactly have they become interested in?? Shakira's dancing or belly dancing? I have only had two people come into my classes ever, wanting to dance "belly dance like Shakira", but from what I heard on this forum and in other places, it was quite a problem for awhile. Some few students went on to become interested in the dance itself, but quite a few left when they realized that what was being taught was not what Shakira was doing, and that they would be expected to learn to dance to Arab or Turkish music, NOT to "Hips don't lie" or whatever.
Regards,
A'isha