what belly dance style is Shakira? - Page 12

sstacy123 · 04-26-2007, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by taheya

From what i have seen she can isolate movements but she has no sense of what goes with certain bits of music. She looks crude and jerky to me, not a good combo!!
Not to mention she doesnt dance to the right music...Saying that she is a good singer, i think she should stick to that, but the dancing is sort of what helps her sell records...she is viewed by the mass media as a belly dancer but the learned eye can see she clearly is not.

Well I for one would like to see how she bellydances-not what she does on stage at concerts-I've been there, seen that, but if she just danced bellydance. I don't think it is fair to judge her bellydancing ability based on what she does on stage in concert.

RioDancerCO · 05-02-2007, 08:06 PM

Poor Violeetsidhe,
I think you've stumbled onto a hot topic! I don't watch TV so it took me a while to hear about Shakira's 'Hips Don't Lie' video. I had just done a performance for a group of brand new beginner belly dancers (all suitably impressed) who then wanted to know if I could do some move that Shakira does. Naturally, I drew a blank

When I finally watched the video I did a running commentary (much to the amusement of my guy friends) listing the move that she almost did.

Basically, her posture is not good for either style (primarily because her back is very arched, instead of having her tail bone tucked) and her moves, while fun to watch are not precise enough to actually be a belly dance move. The attitude with which she dances would come closest to cabaret. Tribal tends to be more about the interplay between fellow dancers and musicians and cabaret (which has its origins more in Hollywood) features more solos or... I want to call it seductive styling. (Not to imply that tribal can't be really hot!)

Violeetsidhe · 05-03-2007, 09:23 PM

wow it has grown since last i looked in... belly dance is a very precise style of dance... this is as scary as debates i've seen over ballet wow

KuteNurse · 05-03-2007, 10:34 PM

I just attended a BD performance where a dancer performed to Shakira. It was a combo of many kinds of dance, mostly hip-hop and belly dance. It was fun to watch however.

Perizada · 05-04-2007, 08:39 AM

two comments:

1) before shakira became popular, i was compared to strippers, harem girls, and whores in general, just for belly dancing. granted i did go to a horribly cliquish high school in a small town at the time, but i'll still gladly take a comparison to shakira than to a stripper any day.

2) i don't exactly understand how 'belly dancer' is being defined on this forum. from what i gather, it's someone who dances to middle easter music, and only traditional belly dance/raks sharqi/etc movements and transitons?

Quote:

Originally Posted by A'isha Azar

My point was and still is that Shakira does not do a style of belly dance.
She incorporates some movement that might be found in belly dance when performed with the right posture,music, spirit, cultural essence, etc.
Regards,
A'isha

i don't mean to attack this, but it kind of bothered me. i'm pigeontoed, which effects my posture when i dance, so it's slightly off from the rest of the people i dance with. does that make me less of a dancer? does dancing to punk and pop music when i'm practicing or with my friends make me less of a belly dancer?

Zumarrad · 05-04-2007, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Tribal tends to be more about the interplay between fellow dancers and musicians and cabaret (which has its origins more in Hollywood) features more solos or... I want to call it seductive styling. (Not to imply that tribal can't be really hot!)

I'm sorry, but I have to comment here. Oriental dance does NOT have its origins in Hollywood. It has its origins in the Middle East. What you might call "cabaret" - if you mean belly dance by a soloist to ME music in a bedleh - is pretty much traceable straight back to Cairo in the early part of the 20th century. There are some western influences - the two piece costuming, the balletic elements - but it does not originate in Hollywood.

Conversely, tribal dance has its origins more in San Francisco, which is a lot closer to Hollywood than Cairo or Beirut. Just saying.

sedoniaraqs · 05-04-2007, 12:04 PM

Thanks Zumarrad. I was thinking the same thing yesterday when I read this, but didn't have the mental energy to compose a response.

Sedonia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zumarrad

I'm sorry, but I have to comment here. Oriental dance does NOT have its origins in Hollywood. It has its origins in the Middle East. What you might call "cabaret" - if you mean belly dance by a soloist to ME music in a bedleh - is pretty much traceable straight back to Cairo in the early part of the 20th century. There are some western influences - the two piece costuming, the balletic elements - but it does not originate in Hollywood.

Conversely, tribal dance has its origins more in San Francisco, which is a lot closer to Hollywood than Cairo or Beirut. Just saying.

sedoniaraqs · 05-04-2007, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perizada

two comments:

2) i don't exactly understand how 'belly dancer' is being defined on this forum. from what i gather, it's someone who dances to middle easter music, and only traditional belly dance/raks sharqi/etc movements and transitons?

i don't mean to attack this, but it kind of bothered me. i'm pigeontoed, which effects my posture when i dance, so it's slightly off from the rest of the people i dance with. does that make me less of a dancer? does dancing to punk and pop music when i'm practicing or with my friends make me less of a belly dancer?

Perizada, welcome to the forum. Before you get offended, please the thread in its entirety. There is not a forum-wide definition of belly dance, which is why we have many discussions and debates on the subject. Some of us, like myself and A'isha, think that belly dance has a essential cultural context. This does not mean that dancing that, to us, falls outside of this context is bad, just that it is something different.

So, no, small individual issues like being pigeontoed does not make someone "not a belly dancer". Rather, overall posture reflects nuances of cultural body language that are important in the dance. And yes, when you are dancing to punk rock with your friends, I would say that particular dancing is not belly dance, which is different than saying you are not a goood dancer, or not a belly dancer.

Sedonia

sstacy123 · 05-04-2007, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perizada

two comments:

2) i don't exactly understand how 'belly dancer' is being defined on this forum.

That is a question I've asked what people consider a bellydancer and though I'm sure someone will say they have answered that question I don't recall having seen it. There has been plenty of discussion about what is bellydance but not who is a bellydancer...that's why people keep saying Shakira is not a bellydancer but I don't see how people can say that based on what she does on stage because just because she doesn't "bellydance" on stage doesn't mean she doesn't bellydance at home or wherever...and in my definition based on what I know of her I consider her a bellydancer...and I don't think you have to be good to be a bellydancer. (Not that I'm saying she wouldn't be good)

sedoniaraqs · 05-04-2007, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sstacy123

That is a question I've asked what people consider a bellydancer and though I'm sure someone will say they have answered that question I don't recall having seen it. There has been plenty of discussion about what is bellydance but not who is a bellydancer...

Check the threads entitled "belly dancing vs. not belly dancing" started by me, and "your definition of belly dance".

Quote:

that's why people keep saying Shakira is not a bellydancer but I don't see how people can say that based on what she does on stage because just because she doesn't "bellydance" on stage doesn't mean she doesn't bellydance at home or wherever...and in my definition based on what I know of her I consider her a bellydancer...and I don't think you have to be good to be a bellydancer. (Not that I'm saying she wouldn't be good)

actually I made this point on the bottom of page 3 of this thread.

Sedonia

05-02-2007, 08:06 PM	#112 (permalink)
RioDancerCO Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 74	Poor Violeetsidhe, I think you've stumbled onto a hot topic! I don't watch TV so it took me a while to hear about Shakira's 'Hips Don't Lie' video. I had just done a performance for a group of brand new beginner belly dancers (all suitably impressed) who then wanted to know if I could do some move that Shakira does. Naturally, I drew a blank When I finally watched the video I did a running commentary (much to the amusement of my guy friends) listing the move that she almost did. Basically, her posture is not good for either style (primarily because her back is very arched, instead of having her tail bone tucked) and her moves, while fun to watch are not precise enough to actually be a belly dance move. The attitude with which she dances would come closest to cabaret. Tribal tends to be more about the interplay between fellow dancers and musicians and cabaret (which has its origins more in Hollywood) features more solos or... I want to call it seductive styling. (Not to imply that tribal can't be really hot!)

05-03-2007, 09:23 PM	#113 (permalink)
Violeetsidhe Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: New Zealand Posts: 53	wow it has grown since last i looked in... belly dance is a very precise style of dance... this is as scary as debates i've seen over ballet wow

05-03-2007, 10:34 PM	#114 (permalink)
KuteNurse V.I.P. Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Duluth, Minnesota Posts: 2,986	I just attended a BD performance where a dancer performed to Shakira. It was a combo of many kinds of dance, mostly hip-hop and belly dance. It was fun to watch however.