Originally Posted by Aziyade

I wanted a separate thread for this.

What are your feelings, Egyptian style enthusiasts and experts:

If a "thing" is not ordinarily common to Egyptian dance, but one or two dancers do it, does that automatically make it a part of the overall Egyptian style, or does that just make it one dancer's particular "thing."

A'isha writes- Anything that an Egyptian dancer does becomes "Egyptian" whether or not it remains signature to that specific person. Each Egyptian dancer uses her own set of movements in her own way, responds to music in her own way and wears costumes in her own way. Sometimes some of the fads catch on in both fashion and movement and musical choices and responses, and then become more ubiquitous among the dancers there. The things that make them Egyptian dancers is not that they are all alike, but that they have certain elements in common that have an Egyptian signature:
* A cultural filter through which they see the world and themselves
* An emotional, visceral understanding of and attachment to the music, which carries cultural meaning for them as well.
* On the physical level, 10 movement families from which they seem to draw movement.
* An understanding of themselves and their role in their own society, which may be very different from how the general public might view them.


Like, Dina's miniskirt era.

Is the miniskirt now considered to be Egyptian style costuming, or is it regarded as just an idiosyncracy of Dina?

A'isha writes- Have you ever seen Tahia Carioca's butterfly costume in which she is wearing shirred shorts??? Is Dina really doing anything new with the mini skirt in that case? I think that belly dance, like everything else has fashion eras and that Dina helped to usher in a new era in which shortness was appropriate costuming. It is not just her thing and really never was!!

Or how about the splits?

A'isha writes- Splits seem to be a movement from the slide family that several dancers have used. When they use it, it is in an Egyptian dance context, so therefore, it is Egyptian. If the movement is being used in a jazz context, then it is jazz. We get REALLY hung up on the idea of "belly dance" movement here in the States and I think that what we need to understand is that many movements are seen in many dances and that it is the elements that surround the movements that make them what they are.

Fifi did the splits in a concert once. Does that mean the splits are an integral part of Egyptian dance, Raqs Sharqi style?? I've seen Ghawazee and Nadia Hamdi do splits -- and other dancers, but always with a Shamadan stuck on their heads. I chalk it up to the "tradition" of Shamadan dancing, and not because it's a part of the overall Egyptian dance experience.

A'isha writes- She did the s[;its because she could and in the moment that she used them in context to what she was doing as Egyptian dance, they took on the context of the surrounding elements.

Anyone want to argue? I'm genuinely curious about how something becomes "traditional" and how other things are just anomalies.

A'isha writes- Look at the word "Hadith" in Arabic. The word can mean traditional or modern, depending on how it is used. I think these words have a little different connotation in the Arab mind than in the western one. It is not even the word itself, but once again, other words used in context to it that gives the word its full meaning. Something becomes tradition by being done for a long time. Belly dance has a tradition of using some types of movement, but using something new in cultural context does not change the feeling or essence or spirit of the dance. It merely incorporates a new element.
Regards,
A'isha



Thanks! : )

Originally Posted by Moon

I'm curious about the answers too, as this video I saw this morning confused me:



I thought splits and stuff like that are not part of Egyptian style? Am I totally wrong or...?

Originally Posted by Shanazel

There is a term in litigation: "opening the door." Briefly it means once someone brings a subject up (usually for his own purposes) the opposition is allowed to follow that line of questioning, even when the door opener wishes the opposition would stop.

Does an Egyptian dancer introducing splits, miniskirts, etc. during a performance of the dance open the door for non-Egyptian (as in non-ethnic, not as in style) dancers to follow through in miniskirts to do the splits? Or do such things remain the perogative of those with Egyptian family background only?

Sorry- I am not putting this well. Try this: among Egyptian style dancers, can only ethnic or native Egyptians innovate and remain Egyptian? If a non-ethnic Egyptian dancer throws in the splits because she saw Fifi do it, is her dance following an authentic innovation or is she westernizing it? This assumes that all of the criteria listed by A'isha are otherwise met- I am not just referring to movements.